New Alchemist

We have been able to get that information. And THAT information is what lead me to ask the question to MODS a while ago whether SMV and EV should be interpreted as the same?

• We cannot.
• By mere chance I go to the barn and what do I find but EV of a few craft products.
• Go back to the list and look for that EV and not there. Hide-and-Seek! But I can be certain EV does exist for some but not all.
• No SMV for crops .....

Getting people to at least consider EV is hard enough. Say you have someone who wants to learn it. If they keep their mind open I can get them going good in crops, feed, products, animals, and breeding. BUT when taking them to Artisan products I run right into the SMV and EV disscussion which are not the same. ..... In the past and up to now.

Sure, I've found a way to work with it in light of the whole game. I also know this way is off target and I accept because I have no choice.

With this new alchemist the SMV business continues. Now what's the reason? There must be one or it would the straightened out along with EV.

I'm sure you have the ability to see it. With the redesign, inconsistency is being continued. Developers know it, have know it, and have not released any information THROUGH THE YEARS to clarify it or assist in working with it. We cannot say with certainly whether the reason will ever surface.

All this is not for the new player. Even knowing that the two different terms exist is a lot. Healthy discussion with those that know will end in: All we can say is that: it is what it is! (Then we return to sanity by going back to lettuce, carrots and chickens.)

 

Since i have been working on Alchemist, Currently to Level 4. The Recent Script that was run to Removed All Basic Gnomes and Garden Gnomes that was sitting in our Barns.

All Basic Gnomes was all converted back into Basic Ingredients, Specially All those Paint Pallets i Got Back about 900 of Them, plus some Ingredients too.

Any Garden Gnomes that was created using Transformation Button which Requires 1 Basic Gnomes plus a Product. All Products will be refunded back into your Barn. They do not get converted back into Ingredients slight confusion here. But All My Products are the ones that gives Alchemist Points which are more in Demand to buy from the Markets.

I have have worked out Values of All Alchemist Products in the Market, in terms of ingredients prices in Current Markets. But currently it is not worth to Craft these Alchemist Products to be sold in the Markets as they cost more to Craft in Alchemist than you can sell them for in the Markets.

I have only one level to go, so will Consumes What Products i have, then sell any surplus i have into the Markets. At the Moment it is not effective or productive to crafts products to be used in Silver Slots Those that reduce times on Others Crops.

We do have an Cloud Row that gives +1 on Vegetables, Further Enhanced with use of CAC in Diamond Slot, combine this with Vegetable Refinements. Or Combined with use of Tiki Timer on Baha Vegetables.

The Revamped Alchemist has push up prices of Bamboo, Cabbage,Canola, and Blueberries. Which will need a load of to be able to Level up Alchemist. These are currently too pricey to buy in the Markets or to be used to craft, with option to sell to the Market

I have Currently have 56,000 Mandrakes in my Barn. I cannot use these to Benefit to make CC in the Markets or use them to level up at very expensive concept Currently !!

 

Mooboy,

Agree, that that is very expensive to level up. I'm not going to do it. If I need the products I'll just buy them much cheaper.

Agree also with Bamboo, Cabbage, Canola, and Blueberry price increase. I'll add Ostrich eggs and Riding lessons to your list.

I'll make sure I have plenty of the crops and products needed on the market for those working on the Alchemist.

Easy ccs from the chaos.

 

Are the buffs useful ? Before the change I tried using buffs for flowers, grains etc. But I found they only reduced few mins. Was I correct in my observation or didn't I do the test properly ? Will it be different now? profitable ? Just curious to know. It will be some time before I re-do all the experiments once again. Want to know your results.

I know Mooboy & broke explained it in their above posts. I am too tired too understand it fully. So just an answer yes or no is enough.

1. Is the buffs useful or not ?
2. Making the products is profitable or not ?

 

Am at level 3 in the alchemist ...i didn't find the potions that useful ...so didn't bother to level up
Maybe i should now ...seeing that is being updated

 

You know what I'm hearing out of all this? Now is the time to look for good deals on paint pallets in the market.

I don't have to worry about all this at the moment as I don't have enough stars to open up the trade anyway.

 

I came here hoping for more information about what to do with the Alchemist so I wouldn't have to use my remaining brain cell to figure it out for myself. Didn't really see anything I hadn't guessed for myself.

All three of my farms were sitting at Level 1 Alchemist because the darling gnomes were too much trouble. I've gone out of my way to avoid accumulating mandrake by not spinning the Farm Wheel when it was a possible prize, etc. Still... I have... accumulated... a mountain of moldy mandrake in excess of 72k!

Since no one else has posted numbers... here are mine based on today's Market prices:

Source of Life
Ingredients
6 riding lessons @ 4236 = 25,578
100 rye @ 99 = 9900
100 kohlrabi @ 130 = 13,000
100 spinach @ 106 = 10,600
100 broccoli @ 191 = 19,100
100 artichokes @122 = 12,200
Total 90,378CC to make yourself if you are buying all the ingredients.
100 mandrakes -- free unless you buy them with BB. Which is a waste of real money, IMO.

Carnations 18:54 [18.9h] - 6% = 1.134h [1:08h] time reduction or 17.766h w/o water or other buffs
In my Market... 50CC each * 200 = 10,000CC / harvest w/o CAC / field
w/ CAC 10,000 *3= 30,000CC *3 fields = 90,000CC Probably break even.
Even w/ water, manure, refinements and Flower cloud row only initial harvest of carnations aka no second harvest of carnations from one Source of Life. (That w/o checking the actual numbers but using my faulty memory.) Need to switch to a different flower. Using refinements, Flower CR and water easy to get a round of roses in same Source of Life. That harvest would be profit. To be clear to benefit from more than one harvest using one Source of Life... one would best grow a flower that can be harvest in less than 8h (or use PPP to extend the life of SOL) then plant the carnations before the time expires. If you use PPP, don't forget to subtract the cost from your profit.

Current Market Prices for the 6% reductions:
Level 4
Happiness Serum -- 47,995
Aroma of Love -- 68,251
Level 5
Source of Life -- unavailable
Philosopher's Stone -- unavailable
Essence of Wisdom -- unavailable

Personally... I doubt that I will bother with anything less than 6% reduction, many others will probably do the same making it worth the money to buy the 4%, on anything less than 12h crops or red roses. Because of RL I probably won't bother to use any of them at all except during events, as already mentioned by others. If one is in the business of growing and selling crops for CC then it will probably benefit them to use the Alchemist products. As usual... one must calculate the numbers based on their own Market and the items intended for growth and sale on the dates in question. I'm not going to try to guess how long it will take the Market to settle out from the excitement of this latest trend but... LOL a few months probably, depending on what else BP throws our way.

Is it worth upgrading the Alchemist? YES, I believe so. Perhaps a future event reward will be something similar to ZAB, MOS, CAC or the Flower CR, for Alchemy. I will do so at my leisure. I intend to be ready with at least a Level 3 Alchemist. Refusing to buy any of the ingredients at inflated prices. I will grow my own when it is convenient. Since I am a casual player and prefer to only login once or twice a day... it won't be convenient to grow such short crops. Perhaps after I get moved back into the house... and my health problems that have been aggravated by dealing with the fire aftermath, have settled down.

For the time being... My Alchemists are now Level 3 but... I'm making meeces and run out of canola. When I get low on feed for the meeces I will start growing canola or blueberries as needed. Yes I could make some Miracle Tincture or Mandrake Powder to speed things along... but I won't be around to reap the benefit of the reduced time.

This also brings into question what is the best order to open the Crafting Trades now? These are useful products. More useful than Confectioner aka CAC making? What is the current price of CAC? Does one have the BB to buy the recipe? More useful than Spa aka MOS making? I'm way past that point so I'll leave it to someone else to puzzle out the NEW, if there is one, best order to open the buildings.

 

SuzeeRabbit Thank you. Your post was really helpful. I will keep in mind the 6%. I am glad to hear you are better and recovering. Good health to you.

 

So, I played a little with the bonuses, played a little in the market but ended up buying stuff instead of selling.
Some high end products were actually cheaper to buy than produce.

So yes, in theory you can have simultaneously -20% and -10% from the Spa mixer, -10% from the Alchemist and -20% from the Tiki for Baha vegetables. They actually fit in the available slots.. I think. That would lead to -60% harvest time for Baha vegetables.
But the Spa mixer bonuses rely on chance or expensive repetition, so it's not really an option.

Will the change really modify the habits of people who stopped growing crops to an extent that will affect the prices or availability?
I'm not so sure.
I think it the change came in to late and too conservative.

I still believe that the Alchemist may have use in special circumstances, reducing time on refined crops during events.
I think I will save my mandrakes in case something changes.

On the positive side, it's much easier for players to level up this craft than before.

PS
The maximum reduction for a crop you can achieve through the Alchemist is actually 10%. That would be with a 6% + a 4% buff.

 

@12ss12

1. Yes and this depends

• When used with specific crops and harvsting on time and have immediate needs to satisfy.
• Especially useful with long time crops. Easily applies to crops grown for drop accumulation during events as time is reduced. (If you have no worry with drops then making or purchasing is a waste. I qualify this by saying that market changes in a specific crop (which is an end result) may indeed cause such a use to be workwhile. I doubt there will be an immediate or significant profit increase available simply because of the use. Holding grown crops for extended periods of time often results in profits. Be prepared to hold.)

2. Not at this time. Depends upon how you do it too.

• If purchaing the ingredient crops on the market and then making the Buff, there is nothing in it at this time. This periodically changes. (If one is a craft farmer then producing the buff will help them to level up their craft.)

The craft product chain
I know you understand the peacock and anaconda chain. Take the same illustrations and use the craft item as the finished product and you will see the chain. Each time one grows or produces a part of the chain one does not have to directly pay others to perform the function. The costs are hidden.

With that said, one can produce the buff for -0- ccs, -0-. The efficiency of the farm use is questionable though. Even efficiency is not a concern to all. (This manner of operations can result in a farmer playing for years and having nothing. Each to their own.)

Each farmer will answer for themselves
How much am I willing to pay for the reduction in time? (Do you even need it or want it? Up to each of us.)

The use decision will get as complicated or as simple as we choose to make it. Simply, time reduction is what you get. Want it? Do what you have to do to get it or pay for it.

 

Thanks, farmer_broke. I understood. Same like growing roses for drops. You can use these buffs for drops. But to increase your stock of crops in long run, these buffs are not necessary or rather doesn't give good returns (taking into consideration all the factors). Normal cropping is enough for it. Buying would be more profitable than making the products. Gathering ingredients to make the product is a nuisance & expensive too.

xristos-ale3andros- The maximum reduction for a crop you can achieve through the Alchemist is actually 10%. That would be with a 6% + a 4% buff.

Thanks, andros.
I tried your combination for bahamarama.

Comfort fields with bell pepper and water & manure. The time is 15.33 hrs which is 3 hrs less than growth without buffs.
With normal 2x2 field it gives 3.53 hours to grow. But I do not have tiki. So couldn't try that option. I didn't try it with Super grows and buffs. I din't want to buy and waste white innocence and fruit cake. May be will do that later. During an event.
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I don't sell any of the artisan stuff, just use for my farm. Tried selling... let's just say I will try again when I have more in the barn.
From what I read here, thank-you all for sharing! As a small timer, growing the crops and making for self use will be profitable as I refine crops as roses, thought it was a waste as I will never get instant, but a 8 hr. rose moves it to an overnight crop for me, and all the ep is good and now I am bulking up on a ingredient for a potion so all wins for me.

What I get is to strive for level 4 alchemist for that 6% then will be a big boost to me, I didn't know you could use two potions on the same field thanks!

 

I find myself very confused by the maths. I read several instances of applying the buffs as totals when I understood that buffs are progressive. Like "a 6% + 4% = 10%" and somewhere else, "add up to 60% off"
But this is not how I was told by a Mod (year or 2 ago).. They said that you apply a buff - 6% of X = Y, then next buff is 4% of Y = Z and so on.

Does any one get me?
Do I have it wrong?

Even without the math I use them. Well I do, now that I do not have to use precious space on my fields

I think its all a pain in the A.. But, I like the challenge of the whole system. Growing your ingredients, (I rarely ever buy) making the product and using it, I have no head for strategy (That's why I Thank you all for your work and numbers, so insightful!) Selling and bringing your coin balance up, trying to keep it up.

Besides the events, I find the this the part that keeps it interesting without being (too) complicated.

 

12ss12, You're Welcome and Thank You. Comfort fields good idea.

xristos, thanks for pointing out the possibility of using the 4% and 6% simultaneously. I did wonder about that, too. I think the players that will benefit the most from that are the ones that don't have the "instant" roses buffs or for anyone tired of roses and carnations, lol. It would be most useful when manure is expensive.

Manure @ 500CC *200= 100,000CC for one field of small plots v one 90kCC Source of Life (as mentioned above) + one 17kCC (current Market price) Elixir of Life = pretty much a wash just for one field. The 10% applies to 3 fields so... 500CC /3= 166. That's if one is trying to decide between using these products instead of manure. Some, of course, will use it all. By doing so they finish events sooner, in case one is worried about drops or RL schedule.

deanarue, for this trade... If you use one 6% and while it is still active you use a second... you will have 8h + 8h = 16h of 6%. If you use one 6% (8h duration) + one 4% (6h duration) they end up in separate silver slots as mentioned by xristos. The results are 10% for 6h then 6% for 2h.

FBroke, "going back to lettuce, carrots and chickens"? SMV? By SMV are you referring to what I think of as the Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price, MSRP? But we're not talking cars here. Do you mean the default price that has been assigned to some items? Such as manure has a default price of 3CC when the price goes below that amount. So annoying. I wish all items had it or not. Actually I wish none of them had it. I think it might be the developers method of trying to "normalize" the price of some items. The result is masses of items at that price. Sometimes it's done out of laziness or forgetfulness. It's really a problem for the less computer savvy tho. The one's that don't know they can or how to change the price. They learn the hard way.

After I last posted I got to thinking... that I would use these buffs more if I had time to grow crops for the Market. I would use one 6% + one 4% + one PPP. Spend the day growing short time crops as fast as possible. Then plant one last crop before the last of the 6% ran out. That would give me a little more than 10h of 6%. Based on my preferred gaming schedule... I would get the most benefit from using it something other than carnations, since I don't have refinements for all of the long crops yet or using comfort fields for some other crops I really need. Good idea, except I don't have the Builder so it would be a waste of RL time. Just not enough RL time to play the WHOLE game.

 

It depends on the buffs. For instance stablemaster rune (10%), water (20%), cheese balls (5%), valentines pot (10%) and the baby sitter cloud row (5%) all reduce time on stables. The artisan product percentages are added together with the cloud row bonus to give a combined effect of 20%. Now the different percentages (rune 10%, water 20%, products/CR 20%) work successively to reduce the time to:

base time * 0.9 * 0.8 * 0.8 = base time * 0.576​

so together all the mentioned buffs reduce the time of a stable with 42,4%. I don't think there is any official info about this, I just found it out by trying different combinations of buffs and seeing what happened.

I haven't tried the alchemist buffs, so I can't say for sure how they work. But I would expect that the 6% and 4% alchemist buffs add up to a 10% reduction. Furthermore think a 10% flower alchemist reduction will add up with the 10% from the flower cloud row to a 20% reduction. And a 10% baha vegetable reduction might add up with the 20% from a tiki timer to 30%, and possibly also with the spa mixer bonuses to a total of 60% likexristos-ale3andros said (I have never tried the spa mixer buffs so don't know how those work). But this'll have to be tested, farm life is full of surprises!

 

SuzeeRabbit thanks for the maths.
I never actually considered using the buffs once. I do things kind of automatically, so sometimes I neglect to explain the full process.
First thing I would do would be to pump up the effective time by 30% with a Pinky pie (10KCC).
Then I would go to to refined Crop square grains. The refinement takes the 12:42h plant down to around 6:30 only with water.
I can easily plant two times, so the comparison would change by 50%.

...... and I agree with your approach that the only way to make this 10% time reduction cost effective is through growing short time crops.... short time refined crops.... but it feels too much like work.

-Mir85- Good explanation. It's not so easy to explain properly.
It is actually official that the effect of "buffs with the same action/description" are added.

So, the flower buffs from the alchemist will sum up with the flower cloud row to 20% (tested!)

The Spa mixer time reduction buffs have the exact same wording as the Alchemist buffs, so they will also work additive.
You can play around with the mixer a little for experimentation. But to actually use the mixer in a more deliberate manner, I prefer to wait until it's developed to a less random process.

 

Can you give me a reference? I looked a while ago but couldn't find anything...

Thanks for the testing of the flower buffs with the flower cloud row

 

Hi SuzeeRabbit. Hope you are feeling a little better.

The game publishes SMV in the crafts only. This is not my term.
This is really not important for those wondering about use of the this trade's craft products. But th
If you go to your barn or the FAQs you will find th EV for items such as lettuce, chickens, and carrots. e information here is applicable to them all.

Go to the FAQS on crops and animals and you will NOT find a SMV. Go to craft products in your barn and you see a few with EV but none with SMV. You won't find the EV listed in the faqs though. (hide-and-seek games) I have sought clarification and they are two differnt terms. You mention default value (DV). That takes one to the market. There is no reason to have a DV for an item which is not saleable and there is not. EV is used as the DV in MOST instances i.e., apples. In the crafts there is no EV for items which are saleable. So SMV is used. All this can be observed, maybe.

I say maybe because if you will look at the FAQS for this craft as recently released, there is not even the SMV which has been released here. Go to the old FAQS and you'll find the SMV but no EV. And not for all.

Now go to your barn under craft products and you will find some with an EV. I have not looked today. The ones which have appeared are those which are not saleable and do not have a SMV. Unless one haphazardly stumbles across the EVs of the craft products in their barns and begins to carfeully look at the trade itself, one will not even notice it.

Sure there has never been a call of craft products. Will there ever be? Who knows but the developers. But if there ever is, what basis will it be called on, SMV or EV?

None of us who know the different terms exist are choosing to torment MODs seeking any further explanation. Sophisticated use and analysis of EV and SMV is a mathmatical exercise with results. Consistency in terms leads to comparability of results.

There is some reason the separate term SMV continues to exist.

Anyone have the SMV for lettuce? (No)

 

There's no need to enslave oneself to the game for 6 or 8 hours to plant short timed crops of the kinds the Alchemistry buffs would reduce their growth times for.

As it was to be expected, many of those time reduction Alchemist buffs got dead cheap in a matter of days and will most probably stay so for quite a long time.

Therefore, a 4% reduction on grains, for example, achieved through using Miracle Tincture, active for 6 hours, will be applicable, within that time window, to any grain from crop circle downwards (in growth time terms), so that to have it still active by the time the first crop in the sequence is harvested and be able to plant a long timed grain, like spelt, for instance, before the buff expires.

If PP-extended (along with all the other buffs), those 6 hours transform into 07:48, enough for even planting and harvesting -within this extended buffing window- a refined crop square or an unrefined canola. (All my examples assume crops are watered).

So, let's say it's a crop circle + spelt successive crops benefited by the 4% time reduction. Using base times, that reduction would mean: (05:40+ 18:37)*(1-4%) = 24:17*0,96 = 23:19 --> 1 hour total reduction, which is significant. It is equivalent to virtually increasing the surface dedicated to those 2 crops by 1/0,96 = 1,042, or slightly more than 4% (the surface liberated earlier can be sooner used for other purposes).

I bought today loads -literally- of Miracle Tincture at 1,5K CCs each. It is paid off, with the example I'm giving above, with, roughly 8 more crop circle seeds + 8 more spelt seeds, which can typically be bought in mkt for 1,6K CCs in total. Without using CAC or PJ, that's the added output Miracle Tincture will yield from just 8 1x1 plots. In other words, for this example of mine, Miracle Tincture makes sense when I can apply that sequence on, at least, 200 1x1 plots, simply because 8 is 4% of 200. That's just one field.

I deliberately chose for the example the longest grain as the second grain in sequence because it's the cheaper grain you can buy in mkt in terms of the free space time you earn by buying it instead of producing it. For any other grain -all of those shorter than spelt: namely, all of them-, the benefit is even higher; the shorter timed the grain, the greater the gain.

You can bet I'll use these new buffs, and intensively.

 

Bought loads of um too and with the same reasoning. Dirt cheap, no need to produce them myself, silver slot, PP used anyway.

Only way to loose if one does not harvest in a timely matter to put fields to alternative use.

Benefits of use during events is unquestionable.

Cleared the market a couple of times and the cheap keep returning.

My friend, don't be surprised one day when you look up and see a gift of an alchemist product. (And please think I made it myself. You know I wouldn't dare.)