Feedback Mill Changes (Part II), Producer Newsletter and Compensation

Here is how the bonuses used to work, the example is for power feed, but the same holds for any feed:

• Rune: 10% of 10hrs is 1hr
• Mill subscription: 50% of 10hrs is 5 hrs
• Cloud row: 10% of 10hrs is 1 hr
• Time for 1 PF: 10hrs-1hr-5hrs-1hr=3hrs

Now:

• Rune: 10% of 10 hrs is 1hr: new time 9hrs
• Mill subscription: 50% of 9hrs is 4.5 hrs: new time 4.5 hrs
• Cloud row: 10% of 4.5 hours is 0.45hrs: new time 4.05hrs=4hrs 3 minutes
• Time for 1 PF: 4hrs 3 minutes

The change is explained at the end of the FAQ, but conveniently not mentioned in the newsletter. Best not to draw attention to something we might not like.

 

Now I'm really furious. Gimme the steam room!

I ran out of donkey feed and I had to mill some instantly for my donkey. Forgetting about the change, I milled 10 donkey feed. After 8 minutes (time needed to make one donkey feed), I went to my donkey pen and found out there was no feed. Suddenly, I remembered about the change. Because of the change, I had to wait the remaining 64 minutes before I can feed my donkey pen. How irritating!

If this continues, I might be quitting...

 

to tell the truth i was shocked when i started using the mill for large quantities of feed. to see partial order already in barn for use was a surprise. the few games i have played in the past, i have never seen this feature. you place an order, you go pick it up when its finished. you dont spend multiple trips going back and forth. dont get me wrong, i too will miss the old system.

the mill is a huge part of the game and there should be more strategy involved with it. that being said, i feel that 3 slots for ques is inadequate. there has to be 5 or even 6 slots now.

as for the other changes i have no input since i do not have mill subscription or cloud row. thank you bp for the free 2 weeks

 

Thanks Mir for explaining it and demonstrating each step mathematically. I think that is how refinements work too right? That time is reduced (water, manure, super grow, refinements, other time reducing buffs like fruit cake) as multipliers (.10*.5*.10) of the original base time rather than applied individually as in the first example. Still those extra 3 minutes means that only 2 PF can be milled with the cloud row as the third PF will cause the timer to expire and making its production the full 9 hours.

 

I find it difficult to see any benefits from this new Mill. I did not read the FAQs before and, to take advantage of the generous gift of two weeks' Mill Subscription, I deleted my current milling - losing not only what I had already done but also the water which overflowed from my tower as I had refilled it after setting off my PF!

I can understand why those who purchased the Valentine Cloud Row are angry about the changes - they bought the Cloud Row in good faith and now it has lost some of its benefit.

Come on BP, please see sense here and put it right - what difference can it make if we do partial milling or not and why can't the Valentine Cloud Row be "tweaked" so it does what it said on the tin when it was purchased.

 

Fair compensation - decreased cool down time and increased buff time for cloud row; my anger subsided somewhat and then I went to my mill. My PF takes longer to mill and now I don't get partial quantities back so planning milling becomes nearly impossible. So what you did was compensate me and then slap me at the same time. This is unacceptable. Unfix everything or just give me my money back for my cloud row as this would be fair compensation.
I also noticed that details on this new fix were not in the newsletter, so yet another lie about improved communications.

 

Why do I feel like Charlie Brown when Lucy offers to hold the football?

(For those not familiar with the cartoon, Lucy always promises to hold the football for Charlie Brown to kick, but pulls it away at the last second, thus leaving Charlie Brown lying on his back on the ground.)

 

From the previous newsletter:

And now you have done it again, with the change to the mill bonuses. Not a word about it in the newsletter announcing other mill changes. That would be bad enough by itself, but giving with one hand (announced in newsletter) and taking with the other (conveniently not mentioned), leaving us worse off in total, when this was supposed to be a compensation, what is that?


To pnp: Yes, that is how most buffs work together, but the mill buffs used to work differently (better).

As far as I understand, one thing was improved fixed today: You will get the reduced time for 12 full hours, when the cloud row bonus expires it only prolongs the proportion of the time left, what you would expect in other words. So 3 PF (started right after cloud row) will take 4:03+4:03+4:03+a few extra minutes, not 4:03+4:03+4:30 (with mill subscription).

 

The bonus code is acceptable for general issues with the mill. I have no problem with that.
It is not however, acceptable as compensation for the cloud row issue.

This is what I expected. BP is obviously trying to avoid giving a refund. So far, what they have offered is not acceptable. The more they "fix" it, the less acceptable it becomes as it means that BP cannot be trusted. BP does not give fair value for the Real Money invested in this game.


EDIT: Oh, and I know it was purchased for BBs but as I play through a third party, I have very few ways of earning BBs and purchased a BB package in order to "buy" this Cloud Row.

 

I think it would have been farer to those who bought the cloud row to change the benefit of the row in such a way it is sufficient compensation that people will not be so unhappy in spending their hard earned cash in buying BB's to purchase items.
Soon people will realise they are not getting value for money and not giving anymore to the BP gravy train.

 

I agree 100%. BP needs to either put the cloud row back the way it was before, or they need to give complete refunds to those who bought it. Their habit of using intentionally vague/ambiguous descriptions (that then allow them wiggle room to "fix" things later) is underhanded and unacceptable. This bait-and-switch nonsense is reprehensible, and I now have zero faith in the company.

 

I agree. It doesn't seem like an honest attempt at compensation, but rather like an attempt to minimize the amount of PF we can make, while not violating the ingame description of how things work. I am now starting to think the vague descriptions are on purpose, so that things may be changed

So much for staying optimistic

 

Thank you all for your feedback I am really sorry this is a disappointment for most of you. All your concerns and opinions are heard - thank you for taking time to let us know your opinions.

Best regards,
teddy.bear

 

To Mir -- thank you for the clarification. I should have been able to work it out on my own but phone keeps ringing, family keep talking, headache...

So...to recap my own situation:
I don't have the mill subscription:

Previously: 1 PF 10 hr with 10% rune and 10% cloud row = 8 hours
Now: 1 PF 10 hrs *.9 rune *.9 CR = 8 hrs 6 min

Not a large difference as it is more dramatic with the mill subscription but it is still longer. The entire purpose behind the purchase was to reduce milling and as demonstrated it does not. Yes, it reduces it from the 9 hours it would be without the cloud row but it is not enough of a savings to make it worth the 199 BB investment because with such a minimal effect on PF, the reduction of normal feeds will be so minor as to not be noticed especially since the large batch production will not fit my farming style.

However, the biggest drawback of these 'improvements' for me is the removal of partial completion.

 

When in real life one buys a service based on a characteristic that service has -in this case, that it will work as Mir explained in her first example above: buffs applied to base time, as for every other single buff EDIT: this claim of mine was wrong, they work as Mir explained in her 2nd example; therefore, mill-buffs now work as they should BUT, even so, they ought to be kept they originally worked OR fully refund us-, using RL money, and afterwards the service provider unilaterally changes the conditions of service, that goes against law of practically all countries, making the service provider liable of fraud (I'm sorry, there's no other kinder word). That service provider can be sued for such commercial behaviour, unless it provides proper compensation.

That's exactly what BP has done with the mill-CR: they changed conditions of service after players had spent BBs (mostly bought using RL money). It basically does so because they are transforming this game into a jungle, where rules can be whimsically changed just because they can. The "compensation" given -15 days of mill subscription- doesn't compensate anything because the damage on the CR effect is permanent. Thus, the only way to properly compensate those who have spent their money on it is to fully refund what was paid, or at least partially so. When they whimsically change what that money bought, they can only "fix" that with either money or fully restoring the original conditions of service (buffing effect, in this case).

The same reasoning can be applied to the change in service conditions of the mill subscription, also bought by players with BBs or RL money -practically, synonyms, for this matter-. In this case, the 15 days of free mill subscription does properly compensate the damage done (even to me, having about 2 months accumulated of mill subscription ahead), because the mill subscription has to be hired: it's not permanent.

All this because of a whim and wrong reasoning: for all buffs, effects are applied to the base time, but not for milling, now (wrong claim of mine: see above), after they changed the terms and conditions of service out of the blue. Not only that: this is the only buff for which its effect now expires when the buffing window expires (this is 100% true, and unacceptable). There's no sound reason to justify that.

The cancellation of partially crediting the milling progress is also ridiculous and unique to milling: any multiple batch in the artisan crafts partially credits progress once artisan products are done.

What are they thinking?

 

I must say I'm very Miffed at these changes ....... 1 i do buy mill subscriptions ........ when we buy a mill subscription .... its mill in half the time blah blah blah .... 2 i did buy the cloud row ..... will save you so much time .....
*grumbles* will think VERY careful before buying things with hidden strings attached .... This ISN'T good enough it's not looking after your players .... Give them a code in one hand with a smile ...... then slap them with longer milling times with the other .... I'm sorry this is just how i'm left feeling after this past action .... I would have thought with the going's on the past couple weeks with all thats gone down the one thing BP would have wanted to do is make the players feel comfortable and regain a little faith back into the source of the game .... these changes don't bode well for peoples feelings makes them feel as if they have been jipped .... ripped off .... taken for a ride ... I'm not a very happy froggie .... i hope something will be done in a decent manner to FIX this situation .... a honest fix .... not a money making generating spin for selling powerfeed .....AND further more to add .... You guys agreed that removing the stars from the events was a mistake ... YET still they have not been added back to events .... so kick us yet again .... there are those of us that are working very hard to TRY and gain stars ... yet again just a move making some players more valuable than others ... *walks away in disgust kicking stones*

 

Hi Aluntino, they are thinking of making as much money as possible out of us and they will use every sly trick they can. It is stated in the March newsletter we will receive fair compensation it seems reading these posts that most of us do not think this is fair, and that BP are trying to repay our trust if this is trying to restore trust I would not like to see what you would do in not restoring trust.

 

First, thank you for the bonus code and for extending the shortened mill time for the Valentines codes. Also, yes, thank you for your continuous work.. be it the design team, producers, teddy (et al?) for translating, etc. A BIG THANK YOU!

But... I have to second a couple of comments above. Not allowing us to coup partially milled items is going to be a VERY big convenience, particularly around events, but not just then. I have a hard time keeping track of all the feeds, etc I need now. I have more than once set my mill to mill powerfeed for most of the day, only to find that I am out of several feed types, and inevitably some that are too expensive to buy or when I have already spent my CC on other things and cannot buy feed. I then will cancel my powerfeed and mill a few of the feed I need. And, there are many, many times when I just don't know when I can check in during the day. I would often set my mill to mill the maximum powerfeed I could, so it would be productive if I was not able to come back and reset it. Now that option is utterly gone. Since adding the second slot, I would often mill a feed for a bit, then set to mill powerfeed for basically as long as I could. ll That option is now gone, too.

Events, too are an issue. I come home at night late, set my mill to make powerfeed. Again, I often either forget the upcoming event or misjudge the time. Its not such a big deal to lose the products for one mill cycle, but not being able to get the items already milled is a BIG issue.

This is even more true, not less with the addition of the third slot.

I am confused by the complaints about lengthened mill times. However, if so.. that would pretty much negate any and all of the positive changes you have made.

please reconsider that change. Or, as I posted in the suggestion section, maybe just give us a slot for just powerfeed. Thank you.

 

You're exactly right, Mackboy...all they're thinking about is ways to grab money. Events every week that deplete our barns (with no time to restock), false advertising of items, bait-and-switch tactics, all done with a smile and a promise that they value us...these things all have one goal: make the customer buy more.

The good news for BP is that tactics like this work. The bad news for BP is that these tactics work once. After that, people learn to be more wary. They have penalized the very people they depend on: their customers.

More bad news for BP: That customer base is going to dwindle. And they might think it won't be significant, because there are always more new players that will join. But here's the thing: the internet is a wonderful, global thing. It's full of games just like this one. We players have lots of games/companies to choose from. Up until now, each of us has chosen BigPoint. I won't be surprised if several people make a different choice from now on. Furthermore, the internet also provides lots of opportunities for customer feedback...websites where people can rate everything from recipes to doctors to...you guessed it, computer games. And potential customers increasingly use these sites to do research before making decisions.

So, BP: unless you're trying to run your own company into the ground, I suggest you stop giving your customers the run around.

 

Hello,

here in Germany a lot of players are very disappointed of the mills changes.
Not only, that you need more time to produce the animal feed. You can´t interrupt a running production, and that is to our disadvantage only.

Some reactions in Germany are very rough, and in addition to the problems we have with the new Farmerama Team, you find frustration everywhere.

On a personal note: because the mill can produce less power-feed, I will do less breeding. I´m sure, that BP´s purpose is to increase the turnover with PF. And this is exactly, what I will not do: buy more PF.

Greetings from Germany