Suggestion Make all recipes available

As a budding, but novice, baker and confectioner, I'm slowly starting to work my way up in these artisan trades - only to find that, according to the FAQ, many of the recipes I'm doing this for I can't actually access.

I understand full well that players worked hard for those recipes when they were introduced (such as in 2011 events), so obviously I do not expect these recipes to be available without a cost.

Yet by the same token, it is entirely unfair that someone should not be allowed access to these recipes because they were too low-levelled or poor to complete/participate in the event, or because they had RL to attend to at the time, or in many cases, hadn't even joined the game in 2011. None of these players are any less deserving of those recipes, yet are denied access.

My suggestion is that all these recipes become available, because it's unfair both to those who can't make the products themselves, and to those who can and subsequently have to make enough to share.

 

There aren't that many recipes that cannot be purchased. Are there any particular ones you are speaking about?

 

Certainly. Chocolate pancakes, for example. More importantly, pinkie pie pie.

 

I'm not sure you would really want the pinkie pie pie recipe. It uses way too many resources.

 

Hi squiggle -just a little more detail about PPP

It is a level 5 recipe in the bakery. I won the recipe in the My Little Pony event in May 2013 but did not level the bakery up to Level 5 until October 2014 so even having the recipe does not mean you can use it right away. Though it has been several months, I have never made the first PPP. The ingredient list is below. Too expensive to make. The ostrich eggs alone exceed the price you can pay for the finished product in the market. I believe it has been discussed in other areas of the forum that PPP is the most undervalued product in the market. There may be other older recipes that are good to make vs buy (I have not done the research so cannot provide a statement about them) but PPP is not one of them. I, for one, am very happy it can be purchased and I don't have to worry about growing/buying all the stuff needed to make it.


Sponge cake dough (base product)
100 vanilla
100 sugar cane
5 ostrich eggs
5 goat milk
30 cocoa beans
100 wheat
50 salt

The PPP recipe calls for:
Sponge cake dough
50 apples
10 cow milk
150 vanilla
15 eggs
200 hay
50 salt

 

There are quite a number of recipes no longer available:

Product	Trade – level	Introduced in
Langos	Baker – 1	Event 2011
Sourdough cake	Baker – 1	TGC 2011
Venus Fly Feast	Baker – 2	TGC 2011
Chocolate pancakes	Baker – 3	Event 2011
Pinkie pie pie	Baker – 5	Event 2013
Chocolate syrup	Confectioner – 1	Event 2011
Gooseberry jam	Confectioner – 1	TGC 2011
Bad eye jelly	Confectioner – 2	TGC 2011
Rasberry langos	Confectioner – 3	Event 2011
Autumn arrangement	Florist – 4	Event 2012
Winter wreath	Florist – 5	Event 2012

I don't think this is a very good argument. Some of these products are actually profitable to make and sell, precisely because there are so few that can produce them. If the recipes are made available for everyone to buy, they would probably become unprofitable like most of the other artisan products. I calculated the cost of the ingredients based on my market prices:

Product	Cost of ingredients	Market price
Langos	3550	3750
Sourdoug cake	800	8000
Venus Fly Feast	MM crops?	70000
Chocolate pancakes	17000	39000
Pinkie pie pie	45000	10000
Chocolate syrup	1200	6000
Gooseberry jam	7000	23000
Bad eye jelly	MM crops?	72000
Raspberry langos	20000	17500
Autumn arrangement	55000	19000
Winter wreath	69000	53000

On the other hand, I don't think it is fair that these recipes remain exclusive forever. It has been over three years since most of these recipes were introduced. I think it is time to give us a chance to get some of them.

 

Perhaps, yes. But the point is that it is my decision as to whether I want to buy them or use my own resources. I should be able to access all the recipes and choose which ones I wish to make myself. That shouldn't be decided for me. Are the resources too much for me to afford? Maybe yes, maybe no. Whether or not I spend those resources on a bakery item should be my decision, and if I wish to spend my resources rather than buying pre-made PPP, I should be able to. I can't.

And from a CC standpoint it may be profitable, but those players lose lots of resources so that others can have PPP, and from that standpoint it is very unfair.

This is precisely my point

 

No one has to waist their resources on making pinkie pie pie There is one pet and one music box that give out pinkie pie pie, or you can buy it cheaply in the market

 

Yes, purchasing is an option. The pets and music box isn't always.
I never said there was no way to get PPP - there are many ways. That does not mean those who may want access to the recipe should not have it. Some prefer to make their own and whether or not that is resourceful or economical is irrelevant - that decision should be theirs to make, the choice should not be made for them.

 

Squiggle, please pay attention to what I am saying

I never argued against this!

My argument was always with this claim. As you like to point out: people make their own decisions. No one has to make enough to share. Either they do it because it is profitable, or to help a friend or because they don't know better (this is a problem with all the artisan products, and it would not help to make it available to everyone).

You are trying to argue that making the recipes available is beneficial to all. I disagree with you. I am not saying it shouldn't be done. I just think it is fair to acknowledge that some players would be worse off.

 

By taking your argument to its logical conclusion, you did. By suggesting that not all players should have access to the recipe, you therefore argue that not all players should have the right to decide whether they make their own PPP or not.

True, no one has to make enough to share. It is always their choice and of course if they do not wish to provide their resources to other players they are not obliged to. However, by failing to ensure that all players can access the same recipes, the burden is placed on a select number of individuals to supply the population with enough resources, such as PPP. Naturally, they are benefited in a financial capacity if they choose (emphasised to prove I understand) to sell their produce at the market, however, it is their barn that is burdened if they do so, thereby balancing out the gain vs loss.
Farmerama has forced selling to become a necessity, because without it only a select number of players would have access to a buff that theoretically any player should be entitled to access. Of course, selling is only done if the seller wants to, and selling occurs because the financial benefit is worthwhile. Nevertheless, taking financial gain out of the equation, selling has to occur in order to circulate products around the game. Markets should not be the only way for some players to access products, nor should some players be excluded from the right to either make or sell their own produce.
As for "not knowing better", there is nothing wrong with making your own produce. Just because you do not take the most economic or financially protective route does not mean you are ill-educated, it simply means you have made an alternative decision.

I wouldn't suggest that some would be worse off.
Making the recipe accessible to all would push the price of PPP down, because it would no longer be a rare item. Having said that, it would not be an untradeable product, because there would still be people who
a) cannot afford the recipe
b) do not use/have open the confectionery
c) do not have the resources to make their own PPP

So the product would still be circulating the market, albeit at a lower price.
Players who make their PPP, therefore, would have two options:
1. Sell, at a profit, but a lower profit
2. keep the produce. Given the use of the buff, this is hardly a disadvantage.

I am. I just don't agree with what you're saying. Please don't make assumptions about my intelligence

 

I agree with Mir on this one. There is such a thing as over-arguing something. With logic one can defend or attack almost any standpoint just for the sake of keeping the argument going.

Squigglegiggle wants the recipes available, others may wonder if that's such a good idea.

I personally like the fact that not every recipe is available to all.

 

As far as I know, I have not suggested this On the contrary, in my first post I suggested they should be made available:

And in my latest post I made sure to point out that I did not disagree with your suggestion:

I meant players producing and then selling on the market, not players producing for their own use. I apologize for not being clearer on this. Yes, I can very well understand wanting to produce things for your own farm, I used to do this myself, and there is nothing wrong with that. However, I think very few players will produce PPP and sell it on the market if they realize that they can earn more cc just selling the 5 ostrich eggs. PPP is an extreme example, were this is quite easy to spot. But most artisan products are sold cheaper than their ingredients. Sure, some products are won at the wheel and can be sold on with profit, but I am afraid many players don't realize how expensive it is to produce a lot of these products.

I don't think there is anything left to argue about:

• I agree with your suggestion on making the recipes available (have done from the start).
• It seems you understand my point that not everyone will benefit from this.
  
  Players who have sold with big profit, can expect smaller or no profit.

 

I agree with the suggestion. The price of the recipe ingredients, market price of finished products is really irrelevant. As noted, people can choose to not make a product, but having it available should still be an option.

I would tie this with an earlier suggestion I made to bring back some older events. Repeat the events where these items could be won.
Perhaps offer an alternate prize -- CC or EP for those who already have the recipe in inventory, or even allow it to be gifted (whenever there is a gift/trade event).

 

please remember this is the suggest box, not the steam room
maybe the pros & cons of recipe availabilty would be a conversation better suited to Game Strategy Discussion

 

sorry